Business

#47: Influencer Marketing Masterclass with Taylor Lagace

Hosted by Josh Gonsalves
3.24.2022
1 HR 29 MIN
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Episode Description

This is an influencer marketing masterclass with Taylor Lagace, the co-founder of Kynship (https://www.kynship.co/) — an influencer marketing company that has helped some of the world’s largest brands leverage influencer marketing to grow their revenues.

About half way through this episode Taylor shares his computer screen to walk us through specific software they use to give us insight into how he actually executes this blueprint. You can absolutely still follow along with the audio only, but you can also watch the video on YouTube. There is a chapter marker to show you exactly where he starts sharing his screen.

About the Masterclass

Taylor shares the 3-phase blueprint that they use at Kynship to help brands leverage influencers and content creators on platforms like Instagram and TikTok to organically market products and services to their followers, and then leverage the content they create to put behind paid ads.

This is a highly tactical strategy that will show you step-by-step how to do the influencer marketing right way. The reason I’m doing this is because I used everything that Taylor taught me with my e-commerce brand Longboi to successfully launch new products using the techniques and process that Taylor walks us through in this masterclass.

About Taylor Lagace

Prior to co-founding Kynship, Taylor worked at Athletes First, an NFL agency, where he was responsible for marketing on behalf of NFL stars, such as Aaron Rodgers, Clay Matthews, and Deshaun Watson.

From Athletes First, he transitioned to the digital marketing side of the influencer marketing space by building out the influencer department at Common Thread Collective, a growth agency mainly focusing on Facebook Advertising.

Taylor’s holistic learning and experience within this space has led him to a greater understanding of influencer marketing, which he hopes to share with others who aim to leverage influencers for the growth of their business.

Connect with Taylor Lagace

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Stalk Josh on the Internet

[00:00:00] Taylor: when you reach out in a transactional way for a one-off post, that's what you're gonna get. You're gonna get a one-off post. You're not gonna get a genuine, authentic lover of your product. You're not gonna get a genuine brand ambassador.

[00:00:11] When you seed product, no strings attached, you're identifying influencers that are authentic lovers of your product, and that lends itself to people posting like this this many times, incredible value.

[00:00:22] Josh: Hello friends. Welcome to Mind Meld I'm Josh Gonsalves, and this is a podcast where I have in-depth conversations with some of the brightest people in the known universe.

[00:00:38] My aim is to spark deep conversations around interesting topics to find the tools, tactics, and philosophies that we can all use in our daily and creative lives.

[00:00:48] This episode is a little bit different than the other. This podcast is actually an influencer marketing masterclass with Taylor Lagace He's the co-founder of kinship, which is an influencer marketing company, that's helped some of the world's largest brands leverage influencer marketing to grow their revenues.

[00:01:04] Taylor shares the three phase blueprint that they use at kinship to help brands, leverage influencers and content creators on platforms like Instagram and TikTok to organically market products and services to their followers, then leverage that content that they create to put behind paid ads.

[00:01:19] This is a highly tactical strategy, that'll walk you through step-by-step how to do influencer marketing, the right.

[00:01:25] The reason I wanted to share this is because I used everything that Taylor taught in this masterclass with my own e-commerce brand long boy to successfully launch new products, using the techniques and processes that Taylor walks us through in this masterclass.

[00:01:37] By the way, there is a section about halfway through this episode where Taylor shares his computer screen to walk us through specific software that they use at kinship to give us some more insight to how they actually execute this blueprint.

[00:01:48] You can absolutely follow along with the audio only, but I also put a link to the video on YouTube in the description of this podcast, and there's a chapter marker to show you exactly where he starts sharing his screen. So feel free to listen through this first, then head over to YouTube, if you want to see what he was talking about.

[00:02:04] And if you found this podcast helpful or interesting, please share it with your friends or anyone that you think would get some value out of this.

[00:02:10] And if you haven't already please subscribe to the podcast, you can subscribe on your favorite podcast apps. You can get notified when I publish new episodes.

[00:02:18] And if you want to get direct links to the resources or tools that we mentioned in this podcast, you can find everything in the show notes for this episode.

[00:02:25] You can find the link to the show notes in the description of this podcast, or you can go directly to Mind Meld dot FM. That's M I N D M E L D dot fm. I hope you enjoy this influencer marketing masterclass, so let's get right into it. I'm Josh Gonsalves and this is Mind Meld with Taylor Lagace. welcome to mine Meld, man. I'm so excited to have you here.

[00:02:51] Taylor: Josh, appreciate you having me, man. It's a pleasure.

[00:02:54] Josh: Yeah, man. As soon as we first got connected on Twitter and you were showing me all the amazing stuff you're doing around influencer marketing, I just knew that you're going to be like, at least for me, like the go-to guy, especially seeing all your Twitter threads and everything.

[00:03:06] So man, thank you so much for being here and sharing your experience.

[00:03:10] Taylor: I appreciate you saying that, man. Yeah, my partner and I Cody, um, first and foremost, we wanna be over transparent with what it is we do and how we do it. Um, just cuz we wanna see people get wins, uh, in the space, whether it's with us or it's on their own internally.

[00:03:23] Uh, that's always the goal. There's too many people talking about influencer marketing that are supposedly thought leaders and guides, but a lot of it's probably the wrong information and misguide people at times. So we wanna make sure people, if they take a swing, they get a single at least.

[00:03:39] Josh: Yeah, man. So I would love for you to kind of explain exactly what kinship is, how you started the company and maybe a little bit of your background in marketing before that. Cause I know you were at a pretty big agency before that maybe you can speak about that a bit before we, uh, get it into the beat of

[00:03:52] Taylor: things. Yeah, well, my partner and I Cody, uh, launched kinship two and a half years ago, uh, in partnership with, uh, a third par common thread collective, uh, where you just kind of alluded to it as well.

[00:04:04] They're a growth agency where I previously worked, um, uh, spearheaded, the influence department there as well prior to common thread collective. I was at an NFL marketing C called athletes first. Um, they represent guys like play Matthews, Aaron Rogers, Deshaun Watson think state farm commercials and Aaron Rogers like that's was, um, my position prior to, uh, commentary collective.

[00:04:27] And then before that, uh, launched a company called tonight in college at UCLA with one of my teammates actually was P son, uh, Justin Combs and another teammate. And that was my first touchpoint with the power of influencer marketing. Um, but my entire work, uh, experience has been within the space of influencer marketing, uh, almost the last 10 years.

[00:04:47] Um, but yeah, Cody and I, my partner launched kinship two and a half years ago. Influencer marketing agency.

[00:04:53] Josh: That's awesome, man. Okay. I want to dig back into that story. You kind of just told about your teammates. So that's football, right? You played football at UCLA, and I wanna hear a little bit more about that.

[00:05:02] I wanna hear about that story. Like how, what was your first foray into influence marketing? How'd you first find out out about the power of it.

[00:05:10] Taylor: Yeah. Uh, I mean, typical college story. I mean, people that start a business, I would say it was an events company, um, AK party. Um, so we would sell, um, brand endorsements placements, uh, sponsorships ticket sales.

[00:05:25] Um, but it was just interesting because literally every sale off the backs of Justin just posting on his Instagram or on one of his social media platforms. And there was literally no other marketing channel. Um, and I wasn't some savvy business owner by any means. Um, it was just, wow, this is intriguing.

[00:05:44] Um, and it works like crazy. Now the social algorithms are incredibly different from what they were back then. And so we probably would not have been able to have that same level of success by doing the same things today and within the current landscape. But nonetheless, it's what intrigued me with the space and what kept me going into, uh, influencer marketing, um, to this present day, without a doubt.

[00:06:08] Josh: That's awesome, man. So for those kind of, you know, they know a little bit about influencer marketing, I'm sure everyone listening has been influenced in one way or another on social media. Uh, and they know about it. And maybe some people even have a bad taste in their mouth of like influencers and that whole plenty scene.

[00:06:23] So maybe kind of explain what exactly influencer marketing is before we get into things.

[00:06:29] Taylor: Yeah. I mean, influence and marketing is an incredible way. I mean, the, the two ways that we really leverage and work with influencers and the reasons why is for mass content creation, uh, there's a massive arbitrage opportunity around content creation with influencers.

[00:06:45] You can get a ton of it. It's top performing content across, uh, all distribution channels and you can get it in a very cost effective way. So content creation is one and then two mass distribution, mass, organic distribution, um, paid media, you know, ever since the, I was 14, update is becoming less, um, many brands were over indexed on paid media, specifically Facebook.

[00:07:10] Um, and . With that being less of a viable channel as it once was, you know, you need to build your organic distribution channels out and influencer marketing is a massive one. Um, where. Content creation as one, you can create this organic flywheel, um, that lends itself to content creation on a consistent basis one, and then two, you can have mass organic distribution from these individuals that have clout over your target demographic.

[00:07:37] So very powerful, you know, two birds, one stone type of thing, uh, as an acquisition channel.

[00:07:44] Josh: Okay. That's awesome. So what I'm kind of hearing is you're giving them access to your product or solution, whatever it is so they can post post it online. So you're getting the first hit of like, okay, like, you know that they're gonna distribute it to however, tens of thousands or whatever it is, could be up to millions.

[00:08:00] Maybe get into like the micro influencer versus macro. What there is, are these like full on celebrities, the differences between those. And then people are seeing it already. Maybe they cl swipe up. If it's Instagram, maybe they click on it and then you're also gonna take their content and use that for paid ads.

[00:08:17] Right. So that will be your content that you use to distribute. So is that sort of the playbook? Am I kind of hitting on that? Right? Is there something else missing in there? Is there a, a larger space to, to be seeing.

[00:08:29] Taylor: Yeah. I mean, I would love to take your, your listeners through our exact process, but from a high level, 100%, you're hidden on the head of the nail.

[00:08:37] Um, there's nitty gritty details within the process, like seating, no strings attached. Like what does that mean? Um, and what does that lend itself to would love to take them through that? Because at the end of the day, Josh, from this time from this segment, do want people that are listening to have an actionable takeaway to go try this internally and get a win for themselves.

[00:08:56] Um, so if we want to get specific, I know we want to go through the actual platform today as well, but what the process entails to begin with to, you know, get mass distribution from influencers and get mass content creation, uh, content creation would be, be happy to do so let's

[00:09:11] Josh: do it, man. Let's jump right into this masterclass.

[00:09:14] Taylor: Okay. Yeah, of course. Well, from just as I always say initially, and please Josh, stop me at any point. You know, me, I can go down some rabbit holes, so please ask questions, um, along the way for listeners too. Um, but first and foremost, like budget, you know, what should I budget for something like this? Um, what I would say, and what would typically say is take 2% of your annual revenue, um, and dedicate that to what we call as influencers seating.

[00:09:43] So if you're a brand with. 1 million, you know, 2% of 1 million, 200,000, 20,000, $20,000, uh, dedicated to seeding at this point. Um, let's say your product is the cogs of your product is $10. Um, and again, just do the math apply the math here. I'm just giving you the formula, uh, $20,000 divided by 10. At that a point $10 cogs of your product.

[00:10:07] You're looking at 2000 products. You can seed 2000 products over the course of the year. Divide that by 12. Let's just say 10 for purposes of this example, you have 200 products per month to send out to influencers through seeding. Okay. So what is seeding? I've said seeding a lot. Budget wise. That's how you get to it.

[00:10:26] If it's a million dollar company, you have about 200 products to send out per month. So influencer seating, our process here of send it's like gifting, but not we're sending out products, not gifting to, to allude to the difference here. Gifting products and gifting programs, uh, lends itself to a very transactional philosophical strategy of influencer marketing.

[00:10:47] So Josh I'll gift you this so long as you post for me, I'll gift you this so long as you do. It's it's a transactional relationship being built from the jump where seating, what we call seating. Uh, it's no strings attached. So basically we're reaching out to influencers that where you identify saying, Hey, Josh, we think you're a, a great brand fit, but we actually love the content you consistently put out.

[00:11:09] We think you'd love our product, uh, and we wanna send it to you, no strings attached. And what we mean by that is we have no expectation of you to post whatsoever. Just send us your address. We'll get this right up to you. So incredibly different message and use that verbatim. Add a one liner about your brand.

[00:11:24] Emits that message. Keep it short and sweet. Just a one liner. Insert that into that message. Um, literally go back, listen to it and just insert that one liner. And you can use that repurpose. It, it works incredibly well, but as you'll see, that's incredibly different than, Hey, we'll send you this product in exchange for a post.

[00:11:42] Very transactional, very spammy. And this is what everyone else really does. You don't stand out in any sort of way where this message is a breath of fresh air to these individuals. And you're starting that relationship in a way that gives a great first impression of you and your brand and makes you stand out.

[00:11:57] And so even though, again, once this all sounds great, right? We're building great relationships with these info monsters through seating, but we do have expectations. And so expectations wise, what we typically see, um, in order to send out 200 products, just to go back to that number. If you're a million dollar brand hypothetical example, we see 20% of the influencers that we reach out to, to with that message that I just said end up opting to receive product.

[00:12:25] So if you want to see 200 products be sent out in a month, what does that mean? You need to reach out to a thousand influencers that month to get that 20% minimum opt-in rate. Um, and that's what we see at a minimum. So once you get to 200, if that's what you only have allocated, you can just say, Hey, we'll see you next month, whatever it is, you can just save them for the following month.

[00:12:45] But typically conservatively estimate that you'll need to reach out to a thousand influencers and then out 200 influencers that you sent product to in that month. Again, going back to, even though we're saying we wanna send you this product, no strings attached, we have no expectation. We do have an expectation.

[00:13:01] And what we see come to life typically is 30% of those individuals that we send product to end up posting free of cost, absolutely free of cost. And then on average, they post two to three pieces and we so out 200 influencers that we send product to 30%, 60 influencers, two to three assets each, what do we got here?

[00:13:22] 120 to 80 assets. Unique top perform pieces of IJC. And so basically we, we honestly say Josh, like the influencer pay for post model is dead. Um, why it's a click baby line for sure. But if you went to any influencer marketing agency in the world for 60 influencers, post a hundred twenty two eighty assets, you're looking at at least a minimum of 60 K at least.

[00:13:53] And you just got all of that. If you do this internally for the cost of setting up 200 products at a $10 cog. So 2000 bucks, instead of 60,000, you save $58,000 on, on the organic side. Now, what would, you know, 120 to 180 assets cost for content to repurpose it into your paid media efforts, um, where creative is.

[00:14:19] Utmost importance right now, you know, to counteract to I 14 updates, creative, creative, creative, you've just got 120 to 180 new assets to then repurpose. So you need to make sure you have use of the rights though. I do want harp on this. I don't want to miss that point because it is super important, becoming more and more of a thing.

[00:14:36] When influencers end up posting their content, we're falling up with them, uh, with a message that says, Hey, Josh, you know, so glad. Uh, so glad you loved the gift we sent you so much. So you were willing to share this content with your audience. Hey, we'd love to share this content with our audiences as well.

[00:14:51] Can we have the rights to do so via organic and paid social? For 30 days, we say 30 days specifically, it's way less aggressive than in perpetuity. When you say perpetuity those red flags go up, like no, why? No way. Um, so we're asking for 30 days and it's plenty of time to test that content to paid media, see what works and then go back to the individuals, you know, whose content actually in ended up crushing it for you.

[00:15:17] And then you won't have to pay anybody any more than 150 to 500 bucks. And, you know, obviously that content has performed way, uh, more worth than what you're actually paying for at that point after 30 days of paid media. But that's awesome. A lot there. I know I word vomited on your listeners, but again, I want to give action takeaways here and to provide them with as, as much value as possible.

[00:15:41] Josh: Yeah, no, that's perfect. And I think like, like you said, I want people to be able to walk away from this. Maybe they're even listening to this right now, or they're watching the YouTube version with some of the screen sharing. We'll be doing it a minute or they can actually follow along. They can like have an action to actually go ahead and do this themselves.

[00:15:58] Of course they can always hire help. And you know, you guys are obviously probably key people for that, but I think that's a huge thing where it's like, at least give 'em the quick win to get a taste of this, of how this can actually work. And then there's people out there that can help scale those efforts if you don't wanna do it in house.

[00:16:14] But I love the idea of people being able to have a quick win. There's something actionable here, and they're going to get something out of this right away,

[00:16:21] Taylor: 100%. And you don't need to start with sending out 200 products, put, put our math and put our formula to the test. If you wanna send out, you know, 10 products to start, reach out to 50, cuz again, 20% end up optin to receive the gift and then 30% end up posting.

[00:16:37] So out of 10, three, people would end up posting two to three assets, each six to nine assets.

[00:16:43] Josh: Totally. And then how do you make sure that they are going to post it? You know, especially when you're working with smaller numbers like that, cause you just said, you know, you don't wanna be too aggressive. You don't wanna be transactional.

[00:16:52] Don't even wanna say, Hey, please post this. It's just a matter of giving it away. How do you, how do you make sure that they're actually going to post it and you're gonna have some good content to use?

[00:17:02] Taylor: Well, we can't make sure cause it would negate the philosophy. I want to say that because, um, You want this to be no strings attached as much as possible.

[00:17:14] Uh, and so when you do do that and you lean into that, you just see, again, these are the numbers that we just see come to life 30, a minimum of 30% of these influencers end up posting. But how can you make this more? Uh, how can you make this even a, a greater impression, um, outside of just reaching out with that initial message where you stand out, uh, amidst the crowd, um, not only do you reach out in this way, but two unboxing experience is incredibly important.

[00:17:43] Um, so making sure you have an unboxing experience built out, because one, it just, again, adds to that impression that you're leaving on this individual by packaging it with care, you're telling this individual, Hey, We love what you're all about. We care about what we're putting in front of you, and we wanna make this as unique, custom experience as possible for you specifically.

[00:18:06] So creating unboxing experience, creating a seating card within that unboxing experience as well. Um, the seating card is kind of an inception. Really. It's an indirect way of putting a creative brief in front of them without saying, Hey, here's your creative brief? But like, Hey, that seating car is gonna say things about you, your brand and this product that you would want them to say, if they were to post about you without saying, Hey, here's what to say.

[00:18:30] Here's your talking points. Here's what to post. Um, so you stick to that theme of no strings attached and you lean into that while telling them who you are, what you're about and spoon feeding those talking points without. Saying, they're talking points at the end of the day. Um, and a lot of the time, yeah, you see these individuals, um, within two to three days of receiving the gift, uh, that we're seating them end up posting.

[00:18:53] And if they don't, Hey, we typically send them a message that serves as a nudge. Um, if they've gotten the gift, it's been like a week, we say, Hey, you know, saw the, you know, the gift was delivered. We just wanted to check in and hope you're enjoying it. And so it's just like give 'em a nudge and like, Hey, hope you thinking about us.

[00:19:12] Hope you enjoyed this and it can lend itself too, because sometimes, you know, they haven't opened it yet. And then like, oh, oh yeah, I've appreciated these guys. Um, so there's a lot of psychology in it. You know, a lot of the times, if you just started these relationships in the right way, these people that actually cost a thousand dollars, do a post and not even grant usage rights are all of a sudden just doing it all for free.

[00:19:33] That's

[00:19:34] Josh: awesome. And you're right. It's the psychology behind it is just like coming at it with a, win-win just a gifting mindset and not being like, Hey, like we're doing this because we want you to post it's like they get it and they enjoy it. Like that's at least enough. But if they do, that's like an added bonus, like let's just make this thing happen.

[00:19:48] And I love that. I love having that mindset. Um, it not too like, um, you know, sleazy marketing. It's not like SL advertising, which

[00:19:57] Taylor: is what influencer marketing is known for, you know? Exactly. Exactly. And these influencers are used to just feeling exploited, used to feeling taken advantage of used to feeling like they're not in the know what's going on.

[00:20:09] Uh, like cuz a lot of these people, they're not lawyers, but they're going into a world where they need to negotiate rates, negotiate contracts. And so they are gonna be, um, kind of outman outgun and feel that way and feel isolated. So if you just come alongside them, um, and start relationships in a very relational way, um, that is not gimme, gimme, gimme, it's give it's, I'm gonna give this to you.

[00:20:36] Start by giving and not asking. Um, that relationship will lend itself to a lot more.

[00:20:44] Josh: Yeah. No, absolutely. So I have a couple questions here and I'm sure some people listening might have is like, obviously, how do you measure the ROI of these efforts? What are some of the tools involved to make this easier?

[00:20:54] How do you go out and find the right influencers? So there's a lot of these things. Maybe this makes more sense where you can kind of walk us through that and then we can have any outstanding questions that I have of, um, after you kind of go through the whole process. So people have a little bit more context as to what this process looks like.

[00:21:10] What is the end to end process?

[00:21:12] Taylor: Yeah, great question. I'll start with the, with the ROI and how to measure success and take this one question at a time. Um, so I guess I'll start with what our tip or what our agency typically does just to give you the numbers that our agency typically does. We typically reach out to 500 influencers.

[00:21:27] So if you go by our numbers again, 20%, we typically send out, you know, a hundred pro per month, uh, at a minimum, like I'm saying, and then we end up seeing 30 influencers at a minimum post 60 to 92 to three assets each in, so 60 to 90 in total. And so how can we think about the ROI on this? So we're not providing them with links, UTM links.

[00:21:48] We're not tracking sales on the organic side. Cause again, that would negate the entire full philosophy of no strings attached. The minute you give him that link, the minute you track sales, you're like, wait, was it just a gimmick that you said, this is no strings attached? Yes. It would look like that. And it would be a gimmick at that point.

[00:22:05] Um, so how to think about though 30 posts. Uh, 30 influencers posting 60 to 90 assets on the organic side. And the value of that, how you can break it down is let's say, you know, you are right in the middle, you got 75 posts between 60 to 90. Uh, and then on average, let's say, uh, the influencer had 50, 50,000 followers.

[00:22:27] Let's just say hypothetically 50,000, the times 75 posts, 3.7, 5 million. You know, that's how many people you're getting your content in front of. Let's say a 1% click through rate, pretty conservative, especially with influencers. I would say, um, you're looking at 37,500, you know, website visits. 1% conversion rate you're looking at.

[00:22:51] And again, pretty conservative. Uh, I would hope, uh, the product and the influencers we're working with, um, can convert people at a, you know, better rate than 1%, uh, conversion rate. You're looking at 3 75 purchases. And so if you're working with, let's go back to the hypothetical of that $10 cog. If you're have a, you know, that's their 30% of your AOV, and let's say your AOVs 30 bucks, 30 bucks, times 3 75 purchases.

[00:23:16] You got a return of over, you know, nine, 10 K at that point, uh, without running the math in my head. Um, and then you got that for, you know, 2000 bucks and that's the organic side. So the value there with this high hypothetical pretty conservative scenario, um, you get your money back plenty on the organic side, but then what are 60 to 90 unique assets worth to you and your business?

[00:23:39] Like people pay absurd amount of monies to content studio shoots, you know, for five unique, um, Like, uh, what, what themed content like 62nd themed pieces of content turned into 30 to 40 different iterations. This is 60 to 90 unique assets that you can create a hundred plus 150 plus iterations off of. So what is that content worth to you in your business as well?

[00:24:04] Um, so value-wise, I, I would just determine if this was a success. If you get. The deliverables I'm San. So if you get 30, if you reach out to 500 influencers, you get 20% optin to send your product out to a hundred. And if you get 30% of those influencers posting two to three pieces of media, each you get those deliverables.

[00:24:25] This is a success, right. Um, cuz you get all that organic and then you get all that as well to then repurpose the thing you have to keep in mind with who you are identifying. Um, you want to identify and we'll get into this as well. I'm sure, but video content creators. And so you wanna identify people that are posting a lot of video content or doing it well because you want a majority of this content that you're getting on the backend that's being posted to be video.

[00:24:50] Um, , it just performs much better organically as well as in paid media. But again, we can expand upon that, uh, a little more as we progress here, but that's how I would view was this a success based on, are you getting these deliverables that were, um, that we're alluding to right now?

[00:25:07] Josh: Okay, that's fantastic.

[00:25:08] That totally answers it. It seems like you should really be measuring the ROI on the assets you're getting back. Cuz you'd be paying much more than that. All the organic sales are just icing on the cake

[00:25:18] Taylor: cherries. Um, but it is, I mean, super valuable though, at the end of the day, as you heard, like if your product it's like it's a five X on the organic side, if you know, you go back to the hypothetical I alluded to in the beginning, like a $10 cog you send out, you know, actually it'd be a 10 X.

[00:25:33] If you send out a hundred products and got 30 influencers, 69 assets. But yeah, there's a lot of that in the organic side, you just can't track it the way you can track, um, content being repurposed into like a Facebook ad account, um, where you can see live performance and numbers associated with it.

[00:25:48] Josh: Right.

[00:25:48] But I'm sure you'll you'll know, you'll be like, okay, like we're getting a lot more sales. Like it's gonna be like a, yeah. You'll, you'll kind of know what you're doing. And maybe before we do jump right into the process, what kind of, um, products, uh, industries. Maybe even services, like do services, even work with this?

[00:26:06] Like what do you see actually works really well with influencer marketing right

[00:26:09] MM 47 Taylor Lagace (Full Episode PR Assembly): now.

[00:26:11] Taylor: Yeah. I mean, physical products you want, cause you want to actually be sending something out to the influencer. Um, and so, I mean, honestly this works across the board in any industry we've seen, see fitness products worked incredibly well during COVID when at home fitness was blowing up.

[00:26:29] Um, but any brand, any product for, um, you know, women between the ages of 25 and 40, um, that's an incredible space. So any cosmetic, any beauty product, um, anything along those lines, but anything, really a physical product that has your cogs under 40 bucks, cuz at the end, that's what you have to think about.

[00:26:49] Like I get the people that come back with. You know, well, my cogs are like a thousand dollars. Like, how am I supposed to send out a hundred of these? Well, it's a good point. It's gonna be harder. But I still would say, if you're gonna start an influencer marketing program, it's you have to start it through seeding.

[00:27:07] You have to lay the foundations through seeding. So even if you're a product that has a massive cog on it, I would still, I can men, you know, starting your program through this philosophy and through the strategy because you need to build it, on giving, not asking with relationships in mind and not transactionally, because that's the only way you're gonna have a genuine community built out around you, your product and your brand.

[00:27:29] So I get that pushback, but you still should start in this way. If you care about influencer marketing as an acquisition channel for you and your business, but who is this gonna be most, you know, lucrative for and beneficial for? I would say brands that have products with, you know, cogs that are below 40 bucks, um, just because they're able to send out much more.

[00:27:50] And obviously as you've heard, your output is directly correlated to how many products you're actually sending out. So brands that have physical products within the DDCS space e-commerce space, um, that have cogs that can lend itself to mass

[00:28:05] Josh: seating. Okay. That's awesome. And have you ever seen it work for software or anything like virtual, like even digital product.

[00:28:13] Taylor: For sure. Oh, for sure. Um, so we're actually like we've come alongside HubSpot and Clavio slightly, um, in like consultation type ways where I'll give you two examples. So Clavio just did a really cool campaign and Clavio, B2B, uh, email marketing platform. Um, but basically ever since the, uh, latest updates around cookies and third party data and the privacy updates came out, they did a really cool campaign, uh, with seating where they found influencers in the space, um, that were email markers, just e-commerce markers in general, quite honestly, though.

[00:28:48] Um, and they sent out these seating care packages, these seating, unboxing experiences, um, they were filled with physical cookies to be representative of, you know, the cookies updates, the, um, and these people, uh, part of their community that were influencers. Were so appreciative and found it to be so creative and they were able to far purpose surpass their goals.

[00:29:13] Um, I'm not able to like speak to this, but yeah, Val, over at, uh, Clavio, if anybody knows who that is, um, said far surpassed their goals within a couple days, um, of running this, this campaign. So when it comes to a service or a B2B company, you just need to think about. What is a product that can reflect, um, our service, our business, um, this campaign that we're running.

[00:29:40] And so that was a brilliant way to bring that to life. And then with HubSpot, they have, uh, they're really pouring into their media, um, arm of their business. And so they have of podcasts that are launching. And so they were curious about how they can get a podcast going and Josh, Hey, if you wanna do this, come on.

[00:29:59] Let's go. Um, basically they were launching this podcast and then to build that out and get influencers to rally around it, we ended up seeding them AirPods. Um, with a seating card that basically just said, Hey, we're coming out with this podcast, basically everything we've said, we love who you are. We love your content.

[00:30:16] You just put out, we, we think you'd actually really enjoy our podcast. Here's, you know, a set of headphones, like a heads, a set of, uh, AirPods tune in right. Some along those lines. Um, but those are like examples. Like obviously AirPods in this scenario are very reflective of what me and you are doing right now.

[00:30:34] And people tuning into it. Uh, so it reflects and represents, um, their podcast very well and seamlessly. So I would just recommend if it's a service B2B, this is definitely still for you. You just need to get a little bit more creative in the products you're sending out.

[00:30:51] Josh: That's awesome. And I think those are two perfect examples and it kind of just goes to show that you don't have to be gifting the exact product that you're selling or that you're offering or service.

[00:30:59] It could be something around that where at least they're getting a physical product and they're unboxing it. And I've seen this work really well with like cold outreach too, you know, instead of just getting an E mail or getting, you know, an ad or even just like an envelope in the mail, you can actually give them like really nice thick envelopes, nice big yellow envelopes that they're used to getting, like, I don't know, like an Amazon package, right.

[00:31:23] Everyone wants to open an Amazon package. And if you have that open up and then in there, nice box, the nice unboxing experience and that product has something to do with whatever your product or service is. I think you're right. That would work just as well. It just shows people that you're a little thoughtful or very thoughtful.

[00:31:41] You're not just sending them a card or something. It's very thoughtful. And then just, you know, give them that card, the little inception of like, here's what we do. Here. You can talk about it if you want, or not even, I guess you wouldn't even say this, but here's what we do. And if they feel like, then what happens, I guess, the psychology behind that, would you agree with this?

[00:31:58] They're just kinda like, wow, this is so awesome. Like I just, I feel like I need to share this with everyone. Like, like what is the psychology behind? Like what do you think it is that makes them want to share that online?

[00:32:07] Taylor: Well, it's like the theory of like, what is it? Reciprocity. Recipro.

[00:32:12] Josh: Oh yeah. Okay. Yeah, yeah.

[00:32:14] Yeah. So law of reciprocity. Yeah, yeah, yeah, exactly.

[00:32:17] Taylor: Right. Totally. So when you go ahead and do something for somebody naturally, um, they're gonna wanna do something in return for you. Um, and this is just across the board. So when you start the relationship in the right way, no strings attached, not asking for anything, you've done something for them at this point.

[00:32:36] And they feel that. And so I think deep down psychologically, they feel as though they want to do something for you as well. And it just taps into like, Again, you are just presenting yourself so differently than this marketplace that has explored them treated 'em like dirt taking advantage of them. You are just coming out from a place of Goodwill, starting a relationship, palms down, giving, not asking.

[00:33:02] And so, yeah, it just lends itself incredibly well to, you know, getting a lot, honestly free value, uh, outta them and from them.

[00:33:10] Josh: That's awesome. And it just kind of goes a show, right? Like if you're doing the right thing and you are actually being a good person at the end of the day, things will come back.

[00:33:17] Right. It's like good karma. That'll always keep, keep going.

[00:33:20] Taylor: Yeah. Well, and a numbers game though, like, like for saying like you have to reach out to five times the amount of people that you ultimately gonna send product to. It's a lot of people, and then you're gonna see 30% of those people that you send product to end up posting.

[00:33:34] But when you think about the price breakdown of that, like that's 70% of people not posting Josh, which is a lot of people still, but in the grand scheme, when you like, think about the numbers of that and like, again, if this is a $10 cog product, you're sending out a hundred. Cool. A thousand bucks for 30 influencers posting 60 to 90 assets.

[00:33:52] Like that's crazy when you, when you think about it, in those, in that, through that lens. Um, but yes, but if someone just said like 70% of people didn't post damn that's a lot of people. Um, but in reality, it lends itself to so much, uh, where if you were to actually up front for this organic distribution from influencers, or to pay up front for 60 to 90 pieces of content, man, you're looking at a price point that's 30 X.

[00:34:18] What you ended up paying, uh, just through sending out your products. Yeah,

[00:34:22] Josh: exactly. It's like that mindset of like, if you're saving money, not losing money, for sure.

[00:34:27] Taylor: Right. For sure. But it's a numbers game without a doubt.

[00:34:29] Josh: Yeah, absolutely. So I have a lot of questions specifically around some of the tools, processes, um, platforms and stuff like that.

[00:34:38] So maybe this would be a good time for you to kind of jump into it unless you have other stuff that you want to bring up before we jump into it. Um, if there's like certain platforms that you are targeting on the social side of things, uh, if there's new ones to look out for, but maybe this is a good time to kind of go through that and then I can have some questions for you.

[00:34:56] Um, based around this whole process.

[00:34:59] Taylor: No, let's, let's jump in. Um, let me know when you can see my screen. I'm sure my screen now. But let me know if you can see it on your end. Yeah. Perfect. I can see. So this is tag, just to give you a brief introduction of tagger So this is a search engine for influencer identification.

[00:35:17] We use tag internally to identify the influencers that we're ultimately going to, uh, seed product to on behalf of the brands that we're partnering with. Um, Tiger is about for the identification piece of it, 1500 to $2,000 per month. Give or take don't exactly hold me to that. But it's between that price range, I believe.

[00:35:39] Um, if that's out of a budget, we're gonna go through this Facebook brand clause manager as well. This is a free influencer identification search engine, not as robust, but again, it's free. It's Facebook. It'll continue to get better and better improve. But to start, let's go through here. And again, we, if you're with influencer at all, you've probably heard of.

[00:35:58] You know, grin, aspire IQ, we've, veted them all. And for identification purposes, this is the most robust platform on the market. And so just to give you a quick little tutorial, a part of our seating campaigns, we predominantly reach out to influencers between, uh, 5k and 150 K. And so you can filter through their fall right here.

[00:36:20] How many followers they have across the board? Do they have a TikTok TikTok, um, is blowing up right now, highly recommend, uh, seating influencers on TikTok. Uh, we typically split our, uh, influencer outreach and our seating efforts between TikTok and Instagram. Um, we just see that the best organic performance, uh, on those two play platforms through seating specifically, um, just to touch on a quick point, we reach out to influencers between 5k and 150 K for a variety of reasons.

[00:36:49] Um, you can do this process with any and all influencer. Sizes following wise, we just recommend this segment because at the end of the day, I would take 10 micros over one macro any day of the week, like com compare one macro with a million followers to 10 micros, with a hundred thousand followers, I would take those 10 micros with a hundred thousand followers all day, day, every day.

[00:37:15] Why? Uh, on a per follower basis, they have higher engagement, higher reach, greater conversion rate. All of the above. Um, their following are more niche and more in tune with the content they're putting out. And so when you compare, you know, 10 influencers, a hundred thousand aggregating to a million followers, those a million followers are gonna be reached in a greater capacity.

[00:37:38] They're gonna engage in a greater capacity and they're gonna convert in a greater capacity in comparison to that one, macro with a million, uh, and not to mention like. Less macros are gonna respond to your influencer C and outreach, less macros are gonna post free of cost. They have managers, they have agents that get involved whose livelihood are literally contingent off them, hustling you for as much money as possible.

[00:38:01] Um, and then just, you know, content wise, when you follow up for content usage rights, like we've talked about, um, with a macro, you're going to look at a cost and price point of, you know, thousands, if not tens of thousands of dollars to be able to repurpose that for 30 days or micro influencers. Um, they're all pretty much flattered that you wanna repurpose their content and there's no drop off in the quality of it.

[00:38:25] Um, they're all phenomenal video content creators, and that's what goes into this identification process as well. Um, so a little background on why we reach out, uh, to the following sizes that we do. But at the end of the day, you can do it for anybody, uh, with any sort of follower count. That's just best practice that we've seen and the reasons why, so on a platform basis, this is how you can filter through it.

[00:38:49] YouTube follower, base, Twitter followers, Facebook Twitch, TikTok, SoundCloud, Pinterest, TikTok audience. Why as male, female, age, location, language, race, demographic, similarity. This is like, you know, if you have a fitness brand, you wanna make sure, uh, their demographic, their followers are, you know, similar to that of Nike.

[00:39:13] You can do that right here, profile individual brand category. You know, what category of influence are they within? Location, are they in the United States in a different country? Affinity? Similar scenario affinity is their actual persona though, like the content they're putting out. So if you want the content that they're putting, putting out to be most similar to Nike, you can do that here.

[00:39:37] Uh, brand safety, this kind of just gets rid of people that may have content that, um, you know, you foul language or they're posting about content that may not be, you know, G PG rated PG that it's probably not our rated content at the end of the day. Right. Um, if you wanna keep it brand safe, keywords wise, what are they talking about?

[00:39:57] What are they posting about? Um, like health and wellness. You can. You know, get people that are talking about health and wellness, um, and you can get really specific with that. And as you saw though, that went from 15.9 million to, you know, I think it was like 21 K. Yeah. So really good filtration process there.

[00:40:19] Um, and how

[00:40:20] Josh: does taker grab these, uh, profiles?

[00:40:25] Taylor: Um, so it's just, it's been online for a long time, but basically their user base apologize. I think Siri might have just heard me their user base is. Um, added by brands and agencies that are on here as well as they have an onboarding team that just goes directly to influencers as well.

[00:40:46] But you can just add profiles. Like I add profiles in here all the time. Like I can add your, your Instagram on here. And so I think just they've been around for a long time. And so like every week this will 6 million profiles by next week and every week, this just, this number shoots up more and more and more and more.

[00:41:02] Um, yeah. And then I don't understand completely how the backend works, but it's able to grab all the data and all the content, uh, of an influencer. So if you want to go actually into one of these profiles, like it's really in depth. Um, so 80, 83% of Christian and model's audience is authentic. Uh, so they're not like bots or fake followers, things like that goes into all his platform.

[00:41:24] Like all his social media, um, handles the content. He's posting analytics, female, male, age, language, race, location, all of the good stuff. Who he's talking about, like what categories, like he's talking about, who he's talking, like, who he's mentioning, you can filter this through like brands as well to make sure, like, if you're a brand looking to do a partnership with Chris Aldo, if you're under armor, Hey, I wanna make sure he is not, you know, posting about Nike.

[00:41:58] I wanna make sure he is not posting about Adidas because you don't want, you wanna make sure he is not posting about competitor brands. You can do that there, who he has affinity with. So if like a micro influencer worked really well for you or organically, as well as in paid media, you can go into their tag or profile and look at, you know, who's most similar to individual to find, you know, even greater success and start scaling that.

[00:42:20] Then content wise, all the content that they're posting, you can filter it through in a variety of different ways. You can add 'em to like certain campaigns. So it's like an overview of how their platform works. And what it looks like. Do you have any questions on that, Jay? Yeah.

[00:42:36] Josh: So as soon as you find some people that you want to set gift and you wanna send some stuff to what's the next process.

[00:42:43] So, you know, we're finding all of these people that first of all, it's awesome. I love how it's like hand picked and you're gonna be adding them over time. Other agencies, other people are adding it. It's not just kind of like taking every one from all over the place. I, I love that about this platform once you're like, okay, I want to start like making a, a short list or like, I guess in this case, a long list, how do we start grabbing people and start putting them into our CRM?

[00:43:08] Or do you even call it a CRM?

[00:43:12] Taylor: So first you just label it, whatever your campaign is called, Josh. And then you just, uh, go to your list by, you know, these are all like a bunch of seating campaigns, right. That we've done. Let's just say, you know, we'll do.

[00:43:32] Slick. So 59 profiles here for slick. I would export this, um, have the list ready to go ready for the brand's review. They get a, they have full approval on this list of influencers. Uh, so slick is by the way, like a, um, motocross like bike wash, um, do year, um, material. And so at that point, after identifying these influencers through tiger or through Facebook brands, cloud manager, we input them into, um, our kinships.

[00:44:04] Well, basically we do the reach out process first. Um, and then out of, you know, say we reach out to 500 influencers, like we've said, a hundred influencers will opt into Steve product. We onboard them into our tool. This is just the kinship seating app. Where basically you don't need to, you know, do one zeroed out order at a time, uh, with your three PL to send out, uh, all of this product.

[00:44:28] This is just a way to do it at scale all at once super seamlessly. Um, this is honestly a product that was created by, uh, my partner, Cody after, uh, his time at KLO, um, K is a silicone wedding ring where they literally sent out thousands of rings per month. Um, because their product cost was like 10 cents, 20 cents, so they could afford to send out millions, like quite literally.

[00:44:55] Um, and so he had the biggest headache of a job constantly 24 7 being, you know, with this three PL manually doing this one at a time. Which is obviously a nightmare. So this product was created out of that place and will help you scale those efforts at mass, uh, at a mass level. Um, so we input them into here to send out the product.

[00:45:18] Um, and then we use ARCA. That's our outsource partner for unboxing experiences. So we create 100 unboxing experiences. Again, going back to the hypothetical scenario of, you know, 500 influencers getting reached out to hundred influencers, end up opt in to receive product. We send them, uh, product through the kinship C app.

[00:45:36] We build an unboxing experience through ARCA with them, pretty good pricing for a hundred boxes. If you don't do like a really custom thing. For yourself, you can get it, uh, between like 300 and 500 bucks, uh, for all 100, uh, those products being sent out pretty good price point. In our opinion, we use them, they do phenomenal work and then the a hundred influencers that end up opting to receive your product.

[00:46:00] Um, we input them into mighty scout and that's what this tool is. So my is, I would highly recommend getting on this right away if you're not, but, and it's super inexpensive. It's about one to $2 per profile. I think two, $2 per profile, you input into the system. Um, and so as soon as we have a hundred influencers that opt oversee the product we put them into here.

[00:46:23] So we'd input a hundred influencers, uh, at the end of the day, which would cost 200 bucks. So what does it do? Um, so since we're not given out, um, you know, a UTM link or a tracking link or something for them to post where we can see when they post and how it performed, um, we get them onboarded into. This tool, mighty scout, which in real time aggregates the content being posted about you and your brand and your product, uh, and all the analytics associated with those posts.

[00:46:53] And my favorite piece of it, you're able to download the content right here. And then, so just to give you like a, like this example here, this is on behalf of animal house fitness. Um, so we've on onboarded and sent product to in this scenario, uh, 1,463 products, uh, to creators, uh, and then 912 of them have posted.

[00:47:15] So obviously this is a lot higher than the minimums that we communicated, right? This is, you know, well, over 50% of the P people that receive product posted, um, where the typical average is 30%, uh, or the typical minimum that we see is 30%. Uh, and then this is well over. You know, three assets, each two to three assets.

[00:47:37] Each this is above three. So again, this is more of a case study. Don't look at this for expectations. Um, but just to give you how this tool works and give you an example, um, this is just based off a $10 CPM, which is off right now a little bit. This is because there's no link again, like I've said, but just do, um, the math on nine 12 profiles posting this many posts going live by the average following rate.

[00:48:04] This is everybody that's posted. What's really cool about this, uh, product mighty scout and just the seating philosophy, this person has posted 147 times 92 times 69 times 55 times 50 48, 29, 24, 24, 24, 23, 23, 21 21. What lens? This is after a year, right? Of doing seating for this brand or almost a year, six months to a year.

[00:48:34] Whatever it is. But when you reach out in a transactional way for a one-off post, that's what you're gonna get. You're gonna get a one-off post. You're not gonna get a genuine, authentic lover of your product. You're not gonna get a genuine brand ambassador. So when you pay for post for a one-off post, that's what you're getting.

[00:48:50] When you seed product, no strings attached, you're identifying influencers that are authentic lovers of your product. And that lends itself to people posting like this this many times, incredible, incredible value. Um, and then here's all their media being posted in real time. So like today's the 23rd, I believe August 23rd.

[00:49:13] So in real time, this content's coming in every day at this point 23rd, 23rd, 23rd, 22, 20 third, 23rd. As you see, there's just compounding value to it. Like 10, 10 assets will come in per day. Ultimately, I'm trying to click, click more of you more here, but it's not, uh, loading. Quite quickly. And then again, the value here is like, boom, I can download this content right here now.

[00:49:37] Bang. And it's right here.

[00:49:39] Josh: Boom. There's the video file. That's awesome.

[00:49:44] Taylor: It's incredible. So it's a quick tutorial minus scale as well. Love this tool. Do you have any, uh, questions here, Jay?

[00:49:52] Josh: Yeah, man. So we're getting this content, but it's hyper specific to the brand. So is it just saying, Hey, only if they tag us or if they use certain hashtags?

[00:50:02] How is it knowing that they're actually mentioning them?

[00:50:05] Taylor: Yeah. So you can input, uh, hashtags phrases, ads, but at the end of the day, it does pull in all of their content. If you want it to showcase, like we're just having this media grid here, showcase content that, you know, in this example, tag, animal house fit or set a couple different lines.

[00:50:22] The, that are input into the system to collect that content and aggregate that content if that's mentioned, but this system mighty scalp collects every asset that they post, uh, across their socials. If you want to deep dive all of it to like double check if they post about you. But typically these guys are tagging or are referencing a tag on line that you put into the system to scrape or collect that content.

[00:50:47] Um, but they do have the ability to check everything they've posted over the last month, since they received your product. If you want to deep dive that.

[00:50:54] Josh: That's cool. So just in case they didn't tag, they didn't do hashtag you can still get that content video or something. Yeah, that's perfect. Yep. And I love how you can just automatically download the content from there.

[00:51:03] But I think you're just showcasing the power of us here. Like you said, it's not about just the one off one and done here. I'll pay you a hundred bucks to post this and use our it code or something. It's like, here's this thing they're gonna love it. They're gonna keep posting it just like they would with any product that they use every day.

[00:51:21] Taylor: Right? Like this is ridiculous. This guy's tagged him 147 times just absolutely wild. And what's cool about this man. Like this guy, knees over toes guy, he's been blowing up. Um, and Joe Rogan is actually a big fan of this guy. And, you know, as a byproduct of that, this brand animal house fitness has been.

[00:51:43] Talked about organically on Joe Rogan's podcast for free three times because we have influencers influencing the influencers through these seating efforts. Um, it's unbelievable what has happened when you can just continue to see it on a month to month basis. Watch the fruit that you know, comes from it.

[00:52:02] It, it will lend itself to, to a ton of value. That is unreal, man. I need to undo the screen here, there it's

[00:52:10] Josh: Taylor, thanks so much for sharing that, man. That is unreal. So what I can do too, for anyone just listening or some people who are like, what the heck did we just go through? Obviously this is recording.

[00:52:21] You can go through anytime you want, but I'll list all of the tools in the show notes for all these things that people want to check out. I'm gonna have a bunch of resources, so we'll have everything linked. And for those who are just listening right now, you know, hopefully you can follow along. Um, that segment will be on YouTube as well.

[00:52:39] So that link will also be a description on Spotify, wherever you're listen to this on. So you'll be able to see the video and you can see mine and Taylor's be beautiful faces while we're speaking about this. And, um, yeah man, so we can kind of like keep going on this. I really wanna jam out on this. I think we have this awesome actionable kind of system that people can start following that, which is incredible.

[00:53:00] So I want people to literally go back, listen to this. Go try these out for yourself. Like honestly, go and try it. And Taylor, do you have any kind of advice for anyone? Who's gonna try it for the first time. Maybe they wanna do it in-house they have a small brand, even for me, like we talked about this before on one of our previous calls, I have I'm wearing the shirt right now.

[00:53:18] Anyone watching on YouTube, the long boy shirt. So like, these are kind of things where like, we'll be sending out, like, I want your ice on like what we could do to make sure that this is, you know, we're gonna get the most out of it.

[00:53:29] Taylor: Yeah, 100%. Um, so we have, I'll just go through additional couple additional details to make sure this is a big success.

[00:53:38] Yeah. My end goal here is for sure. 100%. Josh included all you owners of brands and all you markers. Go put this to the test and try it. Um, when you're reaching out to influencers, um, I would reach out over DM and email. We have a five follow up flow, um, that we have internally that we use. Um, don't be afraid to reach out more than once.

[00:54:01] Um, if you just reach out once, um, you may not get that 30% optin that I'm alluding to that 30% optin or that 20% optin to receive your product comes from a place of, Hey, we have five follow up flows built in, um, where we're reaching out our email. We're reaching out DM. We're follow up with them saying, Hey, just wanted to follow up again.

[00:54:21] Just to reiterate. This is a no strings attached gift. We expect nothing out of it, nothing in return. Just reemphasizing that in the follow up messages, you still don't get anything back. I comment on the TikTok post or comment on their Instagram was saying, Hey, check, you know, your DMS for brand opportunity.

[00:54:38] Um, That's what the, those five fall, the flows entail. So I would do that, make sure you have that in place in order to take advantage of this as much as possible in order to get as much opt-in as possible. Um, you definitely get on the boxing experience dial, and if you don't, that definitely lends itself to greater post rates, uh, and greater content creation and just a better impression, um, on the influencer, which lends itself to a better relationship, which lends itself to greater output.

[00:55:05] Um, so definitely get that dialed in, uh, and set up. Um, and then another thing I would just suggest, like after three months of seating, if you do it at the scale that we do it. You know, you've reached out to, again, we reach out to 500 per month. You've reached out to 1500 influencers. You've sent product to 20% of them, 300 influencers.

[00:55:28] And then you've seen, you know, 90 influencers post two to three assets, each 180 to 270 assets. You've, uh, seen how it performed organically. And you've seen how it's performed in paid media at that point. It, that this is where we do recommend engaging in the pay for post model here and only here. Um, After these nine, you can dissect and analyze, you know, who were the top performers outta these 90 influencers and, you know, choose five to 10 at that point, try to get ongoing content from them, uh, and try to get ongoing activations from them, organically posting and then giving you content to repurposing of paid media.

[00:56:09] And as you do that, you're just building out your brand ambassador program and just do that every three months or so. You can add five to 10 people into that community that are doing stuff for you every month, uh, creating content for you and organically posting, but all the while, make sure you're seeding every month as well, simultaneously to that seed, identify your, uh, authentic lovers of your product, and then identify the top performers out, outside, out of those authentic levers.

[00:56:34] And then just continue to do that. Um, it'll lend itself into a lot of value for you and your brand.

[00:56:41] Josh: Awesome. And just for people, just as a reminder, seeding is the gifting phase, right. Seeding is just seeding the product to them and just giving it to them.

[00:56:49] Taylor: Yeah, yeah. Yeah. And then again, once you identify those top performers, how to engage with 'em in that pay for post at that point, then you're just, you know, at that point you can get them at like half the cost as well.

[00:57:01] Josh, if an influencer, anybody that's done work in the influencer space, if they actually love your product and your brand, and you built that relationship on giving, not asking and in the right way, they're gonna do things for half of their market rates, half the price. And so since you've built it in that way, this person's already posted for you for free several times, they granted usage rights for free.

[00:57:24] And so now you're going back to them and it's like, oh wow. Now they wanna honor me, you know, after we've built this relationship and they actually do wanna pay me. Um, they're gonna be willing to do a lot more for you at cheaper rates, uh, than they would for anybody else.

[00:57:39] Josh: That's awesome. That's really, really cool.

[00:57:41] And also, so you mentioned like these follow flows, like there's obviously specific wording you've mentioned throughout this of like, to make sure that this is a success is very specific steps and I'm sure there's a lot more like tools and hacks and stuff. And some of you guys teach, right. So obviously people can hire you guys as an agency to help out, but you guys also have a, a core right.

[00:58:00] To help people if they wanted to

[00:58:01] Taylor: right. Free plug. This is on plan. What a guy I love. Of course, man. Yeah. Yeah. So first and foremost, we're an agency. We would love to come alongside you in that way. Uh, as a partner, um, if you're looking for that. Um, but yes, we do have a course and just transparently speaking.

[00:58:18] Um, we came out with the course because we wanted to be able to provide value to anybody and everybody. And we typically service brands. You know, we have a couple household name brands, like M and M's that were, that we work with Wilson football, but our predominant and butter is between 5 million and 30 million, uh, e-commerce DTC brands.

[00:58:37] Um, but we wanted to, uh, create a course, uh, like Josh just alluded to, to be able to serve anybody and everybody looking to win, uh, within the Mar within the acquisition channel of influencer marketing. Um, but it's incredibly robust. Um, a lot of what you just heard on this podcast is discussed in even greater depth and even greater detail within that course.

[00:58:57] Um, it's probably covered like half the section of talking points. The other half is about how to implement this into paid media, uh, incredibly effectively for scale.

[00:59:09] Josh: Yeah, no man, of course. I mean, this is exactly what I wanted to get into here where it's like, you have these sort of like three tiers to be able to help people.

[00:59:16] I mean the highest tier, like you're gonna work directly with them. You guys are gonna do all the like work you're gonna be doing all the day to day for them. And that's gonna be big brands. Like you have obviously pay for that. Like that's an agency thing. And then the course like you guys, like, Hey, here's exactly what we will teach you how to do it.

[00:59:31] If you wanna do it in house, if you're like below 5 million below 10 million, whatever. And then if you're just getting started like myself with long boy, we're like, we don't even have the budget for that. Maybe we want get the course, but you're like, Hey, like here's how you can get started. Like, I wanna show you that it actually works.

[00:59:45] It's seating in this best way. See you're gifting in, this is what kind of one to ask early on. It's like, does this work with like content? Does it work with something that is not exactly a physical product where you're gifting. Myself here and everyone listening the knowledge of how to actually do this.

[01:00:03] You're giving us a gift of knowledge. Right. So it goes from there then, you know, they're like, okay, like this actually does work. Like where do I go next? I like kinship. Like, obviously this is where you guys go. So I love your philosophy. And clearly you, you, um, you bring this into your own business and your own.

[01:00:19] He's not just with clients. And that's exactly what I wanted to bring around here. And I love it.

[01:00:24] Taylor: Yeah. And, and we'd be happy to provide you guys with 20% discount. I can give that to Josh after this as well. This is all spontaneous on the fly button. We'll be happy to give you guys.

[01:00:34] Josh: It's a generate that code after.

[01:00:36] Yeah.

[01:00:36] Taylor: But yeah. Transparently speaking, man, like we do apply our no strings attached philosophy to our business. We want to give out for free exactly what we do and how we do it. Like on podcasts like this, obviously our course costs money and our service costs money. Mm-hmm but I'm giving you guys enough, honestly, to go do this and go try it without purchasing the course.

[01:00:56] Um, On your own and to see if it, if it works for you and your brand and transparently speaking, we know if you go do this in this way, you will find success in a way that you guys are happy with and that you want to scale up. Um, and if I'm just being transparent, I know that that's gonna take a lot of time.

[01:01:14] That's gonna take a team. Um, and if you want to do that, the minute that you hire two employees for this, my business is cheaper and we're gonna be able to scale it in greater ways. Um, so yeah, we want to see you guys as no strings attached with this information on how to do it. Um, because we know probably in the long run, you'll ultimately come back, we'll partner up, uh, and that's honestly the dream for us.

[01:01:38] Well, we want to come alongside you and you guys' business. Um, and we do have this intent in the back of our minds. Nonetheless, we do wanna provide you guys with a win.

[01:01:47] Josh: Yeah, no, it's awesome. I think it's, it's the way to go. Right? Cause I'm sure there's other people that would maybe give like 10% of the knowledge people will fail.

[01:01:55] They'll leave, they'll leave a bad case throughout. They'll be like, yeah, open book. This doesn't work. Just wanna show you that it works. So now we can go back into questions. I still have a few kind of end questions for you. Cause I know we still a couple, we have a little bit more time here. So for me, I, what I really wanna know too now is like the timing on here and the reason I bring this up, I'm also gonna link this here, but you had a post on a playbook for black Friday coming up.

[01:02:18] So this is gonna like, we're doing this in August, but like people are thinking about black Friday already. Like you kind of should be. So when there's these big events, whether it's like, Hey, you're gonna be launching a new product. Whether it's in January, February black, Friday coming up in November or Christmas coming up, what does the timeline look for?

[01:02:36] Something like this, where you wanna start building out this campaign?

[01:02:40] Taylor: Yeah. So I had a specific thing in mind for black Friday, but let me just go through the timeline of like a 500, you know, influencer reach out seating campaign. Um, So let's say we start influencer outreach today. We would do, or first it goes influencer identification.

[01:02:59] It's gonna take some time to identify 500 influencers or however many influencers you're gonna identify to reach out to you wanna make sure they're a brand fit on the persona side, the content they're putting out. You wanna make sure they're a demographic fit. Uh, the honest they have following them.

[01:03:14] And then just as important as that, like we've said on this, uh, podcast segment already, their video content creation ability, those three boxes need to be checked off. That takes time. We typically allocate a week to that, cuz it is a very white glove approach. You don't want to just type in, you know, all the quantitative data into tag, into Facebook brand class manager that makes this person a brand fit for you.

[01:03:38] You need to yeah. Do those things. It spits out a massive list, but then you need to go into every single one of those profiles to make sure that they are a great video content creator, because that is what it's gonna lend itself to organic success and paid me to success. Um, so there is a little bit of a white glove approach there that takes time.

[01:03:56] So dedicate a week to that. Um, it may take a little bit more than that, depending on how, how much you're trying to scale this up. You know, identifying more than a thousand influencers may take more than a week, depending on the person that you have grinding on this thing. Um, and then week two, uh, we would dedicate to outreach.

[01:04:14] Um, so that five follow up flow getting as many people, um, onboarded it to receive the product as possible week two week three, we're sending out the product, um, make sure you do ARCA, the unboxing experience. Uh, Far in advance, like starting right away when you start identifying people, um, because it takes a little bit of time to get your brand colors, uh, and your branding, um, built out onto the inboxing experience and then shipped to your three PL to send it out to influencers.

[01:04:43] But week two, week three, we're sending out product week, three contents being posted organically falling usage rights, week four. We're getting that content, you know, into nine by 16, one by one, caption it, all creating iterations, getting it ready and prepped and launched into paying me the efforts.

[01:05:02] Josh: Okay.

[01:05:03] That's awesome. So, I mean, this, like you said, it can work for any kind of timeline, whether it's black Friday, just keep done in mind. Like it takes time for these things kind of, it's not something you can be like, okay. Like a week before let's start reaching out to be, yeah. Like we're talking like months here, right?

[01:05:18] You really want to be prepared.

[01:05:22] Taylor: Right. Exactly right.

[01:05:22] Josh: Yeah. Cool, man. So for you right now, what are the channels that you're really looking into? So you mentioned TikTok as sort of an up and coming one. Is that sort of, one of the ones that you have in your mind? Cause for me, like I've as TikTok creator, some of these podcast posts go clips of these podcasts will go on TikTok for me, I'm on TikTok quite a bit as a consumer as well.

[01:05:44] And the one thing that blew my mind with that, uh, I guess that channel more than YouTube, more than Facebook is there'll be times where I'll be scrolling and I'll watch a video. And then like a minute minute into it I'll be, oh shit. That was an ad. I didn't even realize that was a paid ad. Then there's stuff where you're scrolling completely organic.

[01:06:03] And it doesn't seem like an ad. It's a great thing. But even one it's a paid post. I had no idea. I was looking at an ad because it's so like inconspicuous and like the bottom corner and exactly like, you've been alluding to you here. The content was made for that platform. It doesn't seem like it was an ad agency that made this Polish video or, you know, some weird like, uh, animation that was put into TikTok.

[01:06:27] It looks like a TikTok. And then you're scrolling. It's like, oh, here's another TikTok, but guess what? That was unpaid ad. So I think this works extremely well for talk. Is this what you've been seeing? Is this one of the new fan favorites? I would love to hear about, uh, some of these channels.

[01:06:44] Taylor: Yeah, so like said in previously we typically split our outreach between TikTok and Instagram.

[01:06:51] So if we have 500 influencers that we're identifying, reaching out to, we'll do two 50 to TikTok, two 50 to Instagram, they both have the most, uh, advantageous benefits, uh, to them. Um, when it, it comes to seating, um, influencers and variety of reasons, give you some, uh, influencers on Instagram and TikTok are most likely to post free of cost.

[01:07:13] Um, when tapping into seating specifically, like when you seed YouTubers, uh, for the purposes of them trying to get to post on YouTube, you it's less likely YouTubers. Their content that they post, they post less frequently, right? They post a lot less frequently. Um, and the content that YouTube is putting out are long form.

[01:07:35] And typically every minute of that video is planned out, mapped out, sponsored, paid for, uh, it's a very transactional platform, I would say, uh, where seating to Instagrammers and people on TikTok. These people are posting. It's like content throughout their day, constantly being posted. Right? And so it's a lot of it is the most authentic and organic content that you're gonna see.

[01:08:04] And it just lends itself to greater post rates. If you product to them. Now, if you have an YouTuber in mind that you wanna build a relationship with, and the YouTube is a great channel for you and it works well, this is not me saying don't go after YouTubers. Uh, most of the influencers that we see products who have a YouTube page, uh, and a lot of these individuals are the best video content creators at the end of the day.

[01:08:25] But. They have a TikTok and they have an Instagram as well, and we seed them to have them post there first. And if they become one of those top performers that we've discussed, when we go back and, you know, actually contr contextualize them, that would entail YouTube post at that time. So Instagram and TikTok lends itself to great, uh, greater post rates freak of, uh, on your guys' behalf.

[01:08:49] TikTok is super interesting just from like the capacity of content to go viral is absurd. Um, like on social media platforms, typically algorithms limit, you know, your content, if you post it to reach 10% of your audience, right? If you have a hundred thousand followers, it'll reach 10,000 followers and then, you know, two to 3% will actually engage with your content TikTok.

[01:09:14] You can far surpass, you know, not even reaching, not only reaching a hundred thousand, like a hundred percent of your follower base, but. Transcend it tenfold a hundredfold it's a, the virality CAPA capabilities of their algorithm is insane. Absolutely insane. Um, and so when you have 30 influencers posting on TikTok, It's inevitable.

[01:09:40] One of them is gonna go absolutely viral. You have a high, high likelihood of one of those posts going viral, um, which is incredible. Um, and it hasn't been a thing on the organic side, in a long, long time. Um, so TikTok is absolutely a must. If you're gonna be seating, Instagram, um, stories is great too, because they actually have the ability to click out directly to the website, which makes it, um, a lot better for conversions.

[01:10:10] Um, it's just a media where they have that swipe up link attached to their stories and they can go directly out to the website. I'm sure all the other social media platforms will have that feature soon enough. But for the time being Instagram stories is a great placement as well from seeding efforts.

[01:10:25] So that's why we typically split it down the middle.

[01:10:27] Josh: Yeah, totally. And like you said before, you're really focusing on video content. Like, have you seen this work with video content, Twitter or LinkedIn, or even Pinterest.

[01:10:37] Taylor: So, uh, B2B wise, Twitter's a great one. Uh, LinkedIn's a great one. And a lot of that content's obviously written or they post pictures with it in tandem.

[01:10:47] You can do videos as well, but it's just less likely. Right. And so B2B, like Clavio's. Uh, campaign that I alluded to earlier, or the cookies, uh, that was a Twitter campaign, all the influencers that were posting about Clavio and their unboxing experiences with the cookies that they received, um, was on Twitter specifically.

[01:11:06] So we've seen that be great for B2B. Um, but for D to C eCommerce brands with physical products, I would recommend best practice, Instagram TikTok, split it down the middle. Um, but again, any social media platform that you want to activate these influencers on, I would just DM them on that platform. So if you're going after LinkedIn influencers, not only reach out to them over email, but reach out to them via LinkedIn of letting 'em know, Hey, this is where we are interested in you.

[01:11:36] If it's over YouTube, you know, reach out, uh, to their YouTube email that they list. If it's on TikTok, reach out in the creator marketplace, it's on Instagram, reach out via DM. If it's on Facebook, reach out over messenger, you know, reach out on. The communication outlet of the platform you're looking to activate them on.

[01:11:54] This is the way to do it, regardless of the platform you're looking to activate them on. You need to start the relationship through giving, uh, asking through seating, uh, and that will lend itself to the relationship with the output you're looking for with these influencers. Awesome.

[01:12:09] Josh: And, and, um, do you have, so when you're actually listing them all out and you're reaching out, do you have a certain CRM or tool that you use to track?

[01:12:19] Like, I don't know. Excel sheet is probably the worst way to do it, to be honest. So do you have a favorite of yours that you guys use?

[01:12:28] Taylor: Excellent. It is no, but pretty similar though. Uh, we just use, we just use Google sheets at the end of the day. Um, but you can use anything, right. That I'm giving you, this is the most cost effective way.

[01:12:40] Mm-hmm . Um, but our, our CRM, our reach outs are tracked through mighty, right? Like I've said in the beginning, like everybody that, that we reach out to, well, not everyone will reach out to everyone that opts into receive product is then input into our seating app as well as input into, um, mighty scout. So we're tracking everybody that opts in, um, at the end of the day.

[01:13:04] And then kind of, I would just keep track of if you wanna and be like hyper thorough. Yeah. I mean, well, nevermind. It's Taggar we have a list of, I'm sorry guys. I'm spitballing here. Um, it's a little bit everywhere, but we don't have like a central place. You can on sheets if you like. But all 500 of the influencers we reach out to are within tag on a list that is labeled categorized.

[01:13:28] So all 500 influencers that I reach out to are there all influencers that receive that opt in to receive the product are input into our seed app as well as into mighty scale. And then everyone that ends up posting is in mighty. Then you can export reports on all three of these, uh, platforms, all four of these platforms.

[01:13:47] Josh: Okay. That makes total sense. Absolutely. And then with Taggar you were saying, if it's someone or here, here's an example, this is what I wanna bring into with long boy. We're gonna be focusing on dogs and people think it's absolutely nuts that dogs have viral and influencer accounts on Instagram, but it's influence massive, massive.

[01:14:09] Doesn't have to be humans. People could be pets too. So for sure, they might not be integr. We can go in and we can add their name. We can add their profiles and it will just it'll pull everything.

[01:14:21] Taylor: Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. You can import the profiles. It'll take about an hour to collect and aggregate all the analytics associated with that account.

[01:14:28] But tiger has a ton of pets and dogs and dog owners, uh, within their platform. Uh, most do the pet space and dog space is a huge influencer marketing, uh, space. And we're actually, we're actually servicing one brand called meat kite. Uh, right now that's in the dog spaces while I worked with like pet socks in the past, plenty of plenty of pets and dog space, uh, influencers specifically within the influencer marketing, uh, space.

[01:14:55] Oh

[01:14:55] Josh: man. I absolutely love that. Okay. That that's cool. So that that's good to know. So people, it doesn't have to be just humans, you know, know it could be animals too, which is absolutely insane. It's just like for you, like, when you're thinking about like a company that comes to you and they wanna work with you directly, what are your first thoughts?

[01:15:12] Okay. Like. What are the first steps that we're gonna go into? How are we gonna start thinking about how to approach this? Is it like, is it the same every time? Is it just similar or do you think about something specific every time?

[01:15:25] Taylor: Well, it's an incredibly similar process, but at the end of the day, it's completely unique to the brand.

[01:15:31] What they're about this, the, this process works best when the brand has a story when it's, and when it's a good product and it's a good brand, like any, like any channel, right? When the brand is a solid brand, it has a story that, uh, attracts its customers and attracts its viewers, listeners, every it's, it builds community in of itself and people wanna be a part of it.

[01:15:59] Uh, and when it's a solid product, um, and if it's not just a one off purchase and there's great repeat purchase rate, there's great. LTV seating will be incredible for you. It'll work phenomenally, and it'll be something that you do on a monthly basis. Um, and it makes our job honestly, super easy, uh, as an agency partner, cuz your product speaks for itself at that point.

[01:16:21] And all we need to do is get it in the right people's hands. And then the rest is history. These people will end up posting every month. They'll be genuine product doctors. Like only thing you need to, to get checked off, to get these people to post and make this campaign a great success is does this influencer actually need my product?

[01:16:39] Does it solve a problem for them? Is it a brand that they would want to be a part of, uh, to be a part of our community? Um, something that they'd be proud to represent. If you can answer that as yes. This is gonna be a massive win. You just need to make sure that your product and your brand is ready for this.

[01:16:56] It's a great launch strategy as well, and a brand can be ready for this at launch. Uh, and I would recommend having it ready for that. Um, but having that all dialed in your brand story, your product, what you're sending to these influencers needs to be dialed in in a way where, um, they're gonna fall in love with it.

[01:17:15] And if you can make sure that happens, this will be a massive win

[01:17:19] Josh: beautiful man. I think that's a perfect way to kind of put a bow on this. So I do have some final questions for you. Um, the first one being really is like, what do you see as like the future of influencer marketing? You just mentioned like co being killed off.

[01:17:33] And lot of these tracking tools being killed off. So it really seems like this organic way is the, the way forward. What do you see as the future? And where do you see for me specifically? I wanna know how you would see something like virtual and augmented reality being brought into this, or actually rather.

[01:17:51] Influencer marketing being put into virtual and augmented reality and also in the crypto blockchain space, I don't know how much you are into that, but I know that you're on Twitter and it's pretty hard to be on Twitter without some sort of blockchain or crypto news out in your face. I'm wondering how you're thinking about that as like technologies evolve.

[01:18:10] Taylor: Yeah. Uh, I mean, well, future, as of right now, just in the immediate, yeah. I mean the counteract, the privacy updates in I 14, I mean, influencer marketing is the perfect channel. I mean, to counteract the iOS 14 update, two things brands need to keep in mind is one, how can I reallocate some money, uh, off of Facebook and not being so over indexed on it.

[01:18:37] Beautiful influencer market should definitely be one of those channels for you. Uh, and two, how do I continue to, you know, win on Facebook, um, ads and paid media platforms, uh, across the board. And that's through creative, uh, from, from what we've seen by the way a lot is, uh, it's an attribution problem when it comes to the I 14 update, uh, on Facebook's dashboard, uh, across, you know, 250 million in ad spend having visibility into that.

[01:19:07] We've seen that. It's more. So just an attribution visibility problem, um, where performance on the ad account dashboard is down, you know, 40 to 50%. But when you look at, you know, their revenue top line revenue in comparison to the, a spend we're spending their Mer and blended Roaz before and after, you know, this update affecting the visibil into that dashboard has remained the same and their GA last click remained the same.

[01:19:34] Um, so what does that mean? That means this is an attribution issue in comparison to a performance and effective issue. Um, now for some brands, effectiveness has gone down slightly here and there. Then the day, the name of the game to counteract this thing, if you know, Facebook becomes a little bit less effective in its ability to target the right individual and conversion rate ends up going down a little bit.

[01:19:58] It's creative, and it always has been that to counteract issues that, uh, have presented themselves within paid media accounts. And influencers can provide creative at mass scale with top performing content. There's a massive arbitrage opportunity around their content abilities and getting very cost effective rates with the amount content that you're able to get from.

[01:20:18] So counteracting this, you know, organic distribution wise, relocating some off of Facebook. Influencers great channel mass distribution, great rates, uh, through seating specifically, and then counteracting Facebook's, uh, issues that they're facing because of these privacy policies, creative and you get mass creative from influencers.

[01:20:38] So in the immediate counteracting, this influencer seating definitely knocks out, you know, two birds with one content, creative, organic distribution. Um, so that's one thing. And then when it comes to augment, uh, reality, as well as cryptocurrency, I mean, influencer marketing remains the same across the board for any industry.

[01:20:58] I mean, within any industry within on behalf, any product, any service, um, there's always gonna be influencers in that space. Influence or have cloud over the end viewing audience. Um, that gonna be the case for B2B. That's gonna be the case for D C. That's gonna be the case within augmented reality. That's gonna be the case within cryptocurrency.

[01:21:19] Uh, NFTs are be huge as well with the influencer space already are a lot of this is already kind of blowing up and taken off.

[01:21:27] Josh: Totally. And I think with the creative too, you mentioned like with augmented reality, it's just gonna be the creative. Like, they're just gonna have more tools, like even with an iPhone, like you have, even in TikTok, we were just bringing up to TikTok.

[01:21:39] Most of these videos that go viral are augmented reality videos. Like we're seeing all these crazy filters mm-hmm and funny shit happening with people distorting their faces. And that's just augmented reality. So maybe you're right. Maybe it just doesn't change. Maybe it's just a matter of them. Like just leaving them to their own devices.

[01:21:57] You play with the new tools that's available. If they're using web three technologies and blockchains to distribute it, whether it's now the crypto and blockchain people going into discord channels, instead of influencing on, I don't know, TikTok or something, they're just gonna go their own platform.

[01:22:12] It's just going to where they aggregate

[01:22:15] Taylor: the platforms will change the industry you remain the same and how it operates and how it functions and how it works at the end of the day. Within any space, there are always being influencer, influencing people on that platform within that industry, within that space.

[01:22:29] Um, how they do that, I may have said that wrong, how it functions and how they do that will be different. Um, based on, you know, the tools like you're saying of that platform room. Um, but yeah, it's just gonna be individuals that are able to be, uh, creative, that. Gets people to engage and take action. That is the power of influence.

[01:22:49] And that's what influence marketing's all about. And that's been a thing. This isn't anything new. That's been a thing since the beginning of time, like gladiators were the first influencers, uh, on behalf of like olive oil in Rome, way back when, you know, 2000 plus years ago, it's not a new thing. Uh, just the platforms have changed where people are influencing others.

[01:23:10] Totally.

[01:23:10] Josh: It's just the psychology of influence. So were there books or anything that you would recommend? I know there is literally book called influence. Were there other ones that you have come across or other, maybe blog posts or articles that you've come across that like really helped you out to kind of understand the space.

[01:23:28] Taylor: Oh, unfortunately, not a lot of trial and error over the last 10 years for myself, ultimately get into this refined process. Books wise, haven't come across, uh, a great book within the influencer market space, but quite honestly, there is just a lot of wrong information out there, uh, about influencer marketing.

[01:23:45] So I guess I would answer this question a different way. Be careful, uh, with the information that you take in, uh, with the thought leaders within the influencer marketing space. Cause a lot of the time the wrong things have been preached, um, Leading people to say, influencer marketing is a scam or to say influencer marketing doesn't work, uh, for your brand specifically.

[01:24:08] Um, but it does, uh, it does work. You just need to go about doing it the right way. Um, so if anything, this is biased, but I would honestly just recommend and re-listening to this podcast, uh, take the step by step notes and implement it and see what happens

[01:24:23] Josh: for sure. And I'll also link your Twitter profile because you tweet some interesting, uh, threads, which, and articles.

[01:24:30] I'm pretty sure you post some links to the articles you guys write. So a lot of those things I kind of mentioned with like articles, like you guys do a great job and you specifically had a few awesome threads and I'll link them all in the description for anyone who wants to kind of dive into that. I think you had one on like the playbook.

[01:24:45] You had one on like tools and then a few other ones. So I'll, I'll find those kind of top ones and I'll, uh, I'll link them as resources. So those were, are awesome resources to get started for anyone who wants to dive deeper.

[01:25:00] Taylor: Yeah, amazing. And my DMS are open on Twitter as well. Feel free to reach out to me there.

[01:25:03] If you have any questions, happy to help, happy to jump on a call. Uh, regardless, I won't treat that like a sales call, either. Happy to jump on answer any of the questions, concerns that you have about running this internally. Um, just reach out to me over Twitter and we'll

[01:25:16] Josh: set something up. Awesome. And I have two final final questions for you, man.

[01:25:20] First one is if you had a $1 billion advertising budget to put anywhere you want, do whatever you want, what would it be about? And what would it say?

[01:25:30] Taylor: Oh, relational with like a greater sign transactional on the other side.

[01:25:39] Josh: That's actually key. There you go. And that, you know what, that really, really sums up our whole conversation here. And, you know, I mentioned it like half. That's why I put the billion behind. That's exactly. It's relational over transactional relationships.

[01:25:51] And that is huge. That is awesome, man. That's really cool. Yeah. And so

[01:25:56] Taylor: I love that. Appreciate you guiding me to that. Guiding me to that point to let me get what you're looking for here.

[01:26:01] Josh: Yeah. I'm just trying to rephrase that. I want, I wanna do something

[01:26:04] Taylor: different. Took the, took the question a little bit down the wrong way there, but

[01:26:07] Josh: Hey, Hey. It, it works. It works really well. So don't worry. Um, and man, so my final question, um, you know, the world's kind of like opening up now. You're traveling right now. I guess we should have prefaced that you're on the road. You're in a hotel room. You know, you can finally start doing stuff. What are you most excited about?

[01:26:24] Like work or life?

[01:26:25] Taylor: You guys can't tell that you guys can't tell that my, my bed's not made right now. Um, but yeah. What am I most excited about now that things are opening up? Um, honestly I love being outdoors and outside and just doing things so everything, and I love being with people. And so just everything that's opening up and, you know, getting back to a little bit more of normal, um, is awesome.

[01:26:49] Getting outta the house, just, yeah, I love going to the beach. I love being outdoors. I love being outside. A lot of these things were able to happen amid COVID, but again, being able to go to restaurants, going out with friends, um, spending time with family and people outside of just the house, six feet apart, um, is awesome.

[01:27:07] Something I'm looking forward to and doing

[01:27:10] Josh: that's awesome. And anything within the business, that's like, you're really excited about that. You're able to talk about.

[01:27:17] Taylor: Um, honestly just doing this, getting the word out as much as possible around seeding. Um, cuz as you know, people are typically used to the pay for post model and trying that out and as like the thing that they do to see if influence marketing works for them.

[01:27:34] So what we are really focused on, uh, and honing in on is just getting the word out about seeding and changing the narrative, uh, of how to go about a winning and scaling influencer market success for, uh, brands. And so that's really where a majority of our focus lies. Um, that's what we're trying to get people excited about and get people testing, proving it out to them.

[01:27:55] Um, but yeah.

[01:27:58] Josh: That's awesome, man. Well, thank you so much for your time. And like being really generous here with your knowledge and sharing everything and speaking with me and answering my crazy billion dollar questions. so, man, this is awesome. Is there anything else you wanna plug anywhere else you want people to direct?

[01:28:13] You mentioned your Twitter. Is there any, anywhere else you wanna direct people to before we close up? Yeah.

[01:28:18] Taylor: Check out my Twitter and then check out my partner's Twitter as well. He posts a lot of valuable content. Uh, just like myself. Uh, his name is Cody wood. And then just check out our websites. Well, kinship.co.

[01:28:31] Um, and then again, we can, uh, give Josh a, give you a discount to our course as well. If any listeners are curious about that to check it out.

[01:28:41] Josh: Yep. That'd be perfect, man. Well, I think, you know, there's gonna be a lot of actionable things that people can take out a list. I really urge anyone listening to obviously go back and if you can go to YouTube and watch at least the section I'll have everything sort of timestamp in YouTube.

[01:28:56] So you can see where we started. The, uh, screen sharing, we can kind of at least get a high level view of some of the tools that Taylor spoke about. And then you can actually start implementing this yourself and getting some early winds. So, Taylor, thank you so much, man. This has been an honor and I really appreciate you taking the time to be on here.

[01:29:13] Taylor: Thanks for having me on the honor's mine.

Thanks for coming this far! if you're reading this, it is no accident. The universe brought you to this corner of the internet for a reason, and you're on the right track. I already know that you're an amazing person and I can't wait to connect with you!

— Josh

Episode Transcript

Josh Gonsalves
Mind Meld Podcast Host

Hi, I'm Josh Gonsalves, the host and producer of Mind Meld. I'm also a Canadian Academy Award-nominated director and Co-founder of Contraverse, an immersive media company. I'm a multi-media experience designer living and working in Toronto, operating at the intersection of design and exponential technologies to develop solutions that change the world for the better.

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